Comments for A debate about Kate! at http://www.lisaheidke.com , comment 1 to 12 out of 12 comments http://www.lisaheidke.com Thu, 09 Sep 2010 19:54:56 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.3 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-22 I get the point about wanting to see Kate treated with respect by her family - and there were many times that Lexi cooked spaghetti for dinner, Angus cleaned the bathrooms, and Matthew hung out the washing, vacumned the carpet and did the grocery shopping - and cooked the dinner...riveting hey? Great story...NOT! There would not have been a story if Kate and her family lived in continual familial bliss. Maybe I'm wrong but noone wants to read a novel about perfectly mannered children and well adjusted mothers who spend 'quality time' with their children. We want to read about flawed characters who behave appallingly and make mistakes and people who aren't wise or politically enlightened. It makes us feel better about our own flawed and imperfect lives...those of us who have imperfect lives. - author - lisa Sat, 30 Jan 2010 14:10:52 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-19 OK..I can't have said it better than Elizabeth in the last post.....its not about woman CHOOSING to stay at home and have children or go out,work and have children..THAT is not the argument. I think we are all WAY past that..are we not? We really don;t want to go back 50 years and so that all over again!!. I was trying (obviously UNSUCESSFULLY) to make a point in the FB debate about the way this woman was treated by just about everyone else in the book and about how she sees and treats herself. - panamadlh Sat, 30 Jan 2010 03:17:27 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-18 So, I find myself wondering, just exactly what does "having it all" mean? All of what? There's an implication here that all women who work while simultaneously raising children and being in a relationship are: 1. selfish or 2. inadequate to bad mothers or 3. missing out on something glorious or 4. rich and able to hire nannies and cooks or 5. clearly maladjusted and hence divorced or lesbian. Hold on girls. Wasn't the whole feminist movement (does anyone here remember that, and how our mothers and grandmothers and great-grandmothers struggled?) about honoring women's rights to make choices? And accept the consequences of those choices? (That's called being an adult). And being supportive of other women's rights to make different choices for themselves based on the particularity of their lives and circumstances? I love that Lisa has brought this conversation about through both of her entertaining books. Nonetheless, Kate made me want to scream with frustration. Why don't her children treat her with any respect? Why don't they help out with household chores? Why do they have such a sense of entitlement to her every waking moment? Why does she, resentfully, buy into the idea that her needs and wants ALWAYS come last, if ever? Why does the husband assume, at least initially, that Kate is responsible for ALL the household and kid related stuff and he ISN"T? I raised three children during the 1970's and 80's. Right I'm older than most of you, my kids are grown, all are self-supporting and none is an ax-murderer. I worked because I am tempermentally unsuited to full-time child care and need(ed) more stimulation. It was, for me, draining, boring, unsatisfying to spend all day with toddlers or babies and I wasn't happy with it. I was also, for nine years, the single parent of two and had no option (oh, I could have stayed with the alcoholic, but really...not I couldn't). That's me. When I wasn't working I was "with" the kids in a hands-on manner and we did all kinds of great and groovy stuff. It was called quality time, back then. I will tell you that my children would never have spoken to me the way Kate's do to her, that each of them knew how to prepare one relatively balanced meal by the time they were 10, and started doing or helping to do their own laundry as soon as they were tall enough to reach the top of the washing machine (about age 8 as I recall). It just isn't rocket science. Teach children how to take care of themselves--they will need the skills later on. Demand a certain level of respect and responsibility--if you don't, how will they ever learn it? From watching their fathers plop down in front of the TV, beer in hand, demanding to know what's for dinner? I don't think so... Keep it up, Lisa. "Good on ya." Congratulations on striking such a chord. This debate needs to be happening. Women need to have forums for all their many, multi-tonal voices. - Elizabeth Fri, 29 Jan 2010 12:51:44 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-17 For us, life became completely different after kids and there's just no way that things could have continued on as they'd been before. When you have kids, the number of tasks to do in a day increases, time stays constant!! Both my hubby and I are pursuing our work related dreams in a modified sense. But in order for that to happen, he does a major part of the parenting. We share care of our 3 year old and 1 year old, so he does mornings and I do afternoons/evenings. Each of us works in our 'off-shift'. We quit paid employment and became self employed for more flexibility. We got used to living on a much tighter budget. We spent a lot of time - 8 years - getting this set up before we had kids (not consciously, but that's how it worked out). And we still have days where we're pulling our hair out... Before I had children, I thought I had all the answers, too. What a lovely little self delusion that one was!!! - K L Fri, 29 Jan 2010 10:29:39 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-16 Didn't anyone else think she should have pushed the dad harder about what he'd been doing for the last 20 years!! - Peta Thu, 28 Jan 2010 23:00:42 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-15 Hey, katie, I'm one of those lesbians you're talking about. I have a gorgeous 15 moth old, Zac. Okay, I thought I could have it all. Before Zac was born I thought I'd take two months leave and go back to work full time. Zac would be fine with that - so I thought or maybe convinced myself. BUt I also convinced my partner as well! Yeah, I was wrong. I didn't want to go back to work and I told my partner that. . We almost broke up because she rreminded me many times that 'a baby will not interfere with our lives.' Okay, I was wrong. I had no idea until I had him what an impact he'd have on my life...I was willing to break up with her but we're still together, for now...so am I now a slave because my girlfriend works duble shifts so I can stay home to raise our son? No! It's a choice I've made. But I am lucky she earns decent money- I couldn't settle for being a pauper! - Donna Thu, 28 Jan 2010 22:55:59 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-14 Hi FJ, I Live in Broome and have just finished reading What Kate did Next. I'm bloody well inspired! Don't know where you're from but your obviously a country chick! Mate, just keep doing what you're doing. It's tough in the bush, but even tougher in the desert. - Claudia Thu, 28 Jan 2010 22:45:23 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-13 Forget about all that crap! What did everyone think of the sister? I loved her! Anyone who's in denial about thier pregnancy has my vote! Yes, dream of taking yourself off to an Ashram as long as you can! - Sam Thu, 28 Jan 2010 22:40:44 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-12 Amanda, I have a 14 year old son who says that to me 24/7! Why don't I have a life? Because I'm looking after him and his two sisters, that's why? I kinda get what the author's saying here - tell me any mom who's got everything going for her at once - hello! Does Lisa's sister have any kids? I bet if you're one of those mom's who's got it 'all happening' then you're divorced or you're a lesbian - not that there's anything wrong with that! - Katie Thu, 28 Jan 2010 22:35:16 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-11 Wow! I haven't read Lisa's book but I have a 13 yr old daughter and she says that to me on a regular basis! (From a mum in Vancouver - we're the same the world over, hey?) - amanda Thu, 28 Jan 2010 22:27:39 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-10 Karly, I really agree with you! And I'm pleased you made a comment because I started to, then I thought: 'What if I'm WRONG!' No we can't have it all at the same time. I work on the farm, try and raise kids, look after the farm office, cooking, cleaning and write - I'm so pleased I live on a farm because you always have warning when somebody is coming to visit and you can tidy. Otherwise, my garden is a jungle, my laundry is overflowing and the rest of my house is a mess! And yes, it causes friction between my husband and I at times. I can't tell you how annoyed I get when the boss comes home and flops in a chair, after a hard days work and cracks open a beer, while I'm listening to kids reading and trying to get tea at the same time. Super mum? No such thing. Who would seriously want to wear their lacies over the top of their jeans, anyway? - FJ Thu, 28 Jan 2010 16:19:05 +0100 http://www.lisaheidke.com/lisas-blog-2/32.html#comment-9 I think Kate got it spot on. Women can't have it all--- all at once- not if they have kids. It's a fact. If you have it all- then something has had to give. Whether it's been the kids you've had to drop off at day care at 6.30 am every morning to get into work and picked up again at 6.30 pm on your way home- that's a sacrifice - that child and that mother have missed out on a whole day together and you dont get that back. Right or wrong- day care v's stay at home mum- it doesn't matter.. if you've made a choice to work while you have kids- there's been a sacrifice. People who say they can have it all- are usually theso called super mums with a house keeper a nanny and a full time cook living in the house- and good luck to them but they aren't super mums- they aren't the ones chasing kids all day and thinking of something to cook for dinner and doing the laundry, shopping for food, taking kids to and from school, sitting in a phone cue for an hour to change an account!!! They have simply put themselves first and had to employ someone else to take up the slack. I'm not anti women working- but the reality is - if you make a choice to have kids- or even if you didn't and you still ended up with them!!! -- then you have an obligation to those kids... maybe that's unfair- but that's the way it is- you can always hope you come back next life as a male - then you CAN obviously have it all!!!! - Karly Thu, 28 Jan 2010 13:50:40 +0100